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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 25 post(s) |
Arya Greywolf
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
46
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Posted - 2013.04.10 14:35:00 -
[1] - Quote
Seeing as the Megathron and Hyperion got insane buffs on your last pass over, I think the main armor, laser boat of the Amarr should get a buff as well.
These changes would be very becoming of the Abaddon:
-2 high slots, make it 10% damage per level --> like the hyperion got.
+1 low, so 8 lows --> like the Megathron got.
Amarr is the armor race. The Abaddon is supposed to be a massive brick. If the megathron is getting an 8th low, the Abaddon needs one too. |
Arya Greywolf
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
46
|
Posted - 2013.04.10 14:47:00 -
[2] - Quote
Rynnik wrote:All three of these BS share 4 mids, 7 lows. You may have diversified away from lasers on all of them but you sure didn't shake up much else - especially in light of a Gallente 8 low BS. How about a Hyperion treatment with double damage bonus on 6 turrets for the Apoc. That further assists the cap issues and allows a slot to be reallocated to the lows.
This a million times. Everyone needs to keep quoting this. If you're going to tweak the Gallente slots to fit their roles, so do you need to tweak the Amarr and other races. Abaddon needs 8th low slot.
Additionally, please think about the Armageddon design. It's going to be a neut and drone boat. 4 Mids is pushing it. Please look at taking a high out for a mid. It's going to need a cap boosters, drone links, web, mwd, etc. With no damage bonus besides drones, take a high out for a mid. Do it. |
Arya Greywolf
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
46
|
Posted - 2013.04.10 14:48:00 -
[3] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:Tonto Auri wrote:Crash Lander wrote:Atomic Option wrote:After sleeping on it, the simplest statement of the problem with the Apoc change is that:
the new bonus to tracking doesn't synergize well with the optimal bonus.
When do you most need optimal? When you're far away.
When do you most need tracking? When you're closer to an orbiting target.
The cap bonus can synergize with any fit that uses lasers, but the tracking bonus isn't useful in as many situations. If you want to move away from cap bonuses, find something else that synergizes with optimal. QFT. How the hell I missed this post? Care to provide a link? That person deserve a "like". You might consider that apparently this person has never flown an Apoc in anger, nor as part of a fleet. A tracking bonus is a huge boost to these ships in a kiting role. Laser tracking has always been it's weak point. Inability to track incoming tacklers and kill them fast enough to leverage their range advantage has always been the Apoc's weak point. If a workable cap level can be arrived at, then tracking is probably the PERFECT bonus for this ship in it's attack role. I would respectfully suggest some folks spend less time using EFT and it's bretheren, and more time actually flying the ships they are offering comment on.
Regardless of what else is said in this thread about the other changes... anyone who disagrees with the Apoc's new tracking bonus is whack. It is awesome.
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Arya Greywolf
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
47
|
Posted - 2013.04.10 17:26:00 -
[4] - Quote
CCP Rise please think for a moment and explain why not a single amarr battleship has an 8th low slot.
Amarr have huge difficulties with cap, this is known. The fact that they are limited in mids makes that more difficult because they must use one for cap boosters.
You rightly saw that the Gallente BS boates might have difficulties filling their new roles without changing around some slots and bonuses.
To me, the Armageddon pre tiercide was close to what an Amarr brawler BS should have been. Now, in its place you have the Abaddon. However, being Amarr laser armor boat (THE laser armor BS of EVE), with all the other changes, --it's just OK.
I understand that you wanted to buff other boats and maybe leave some ones that were in a good spot the way they were but you have to remember you still are buffing other ships, so the Abaddon needs a boost as well. Don't neglect it (or the Rokh for that matter - even though I haven't had the time to look it over) because it was "fine" before.
Please consider removing 2 highs, making the bonus 10% damage to lasers, and finally giving it the 8th low that THE Amarr laser/armor BS needs.
This will do several things: 1) help cap issues 2) make it that armor brick it's supposed to be and 3) bring it in line with the other BS buffs. |
Arya Greywolf
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
47
|
Posted - 2013.04.11 04:42:00 -
[5] - Quote
CCP Rise wrote:May Wanderdriven wrote:I don't understand why they can't remove 1 gun from the apocalypse and double the damage bonus. The biggest reason is that there isn't a damage bonus 
So instead of responding to the _many_ people that posted well thought out opinions on why the ABADDON and not the Apoc should get this -2 turret 10% treatment +1 lowslot, you respond to the one person that is easiest to target and poke fun at.
Awesome.
Please re-read these responses. There are very good points about cap issues on all Amarr BSs, lack of mid slots on the Apoc (take a high out), and serious doubts on why not a single Amarr BS has 8 lows.
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Arya Greywolf
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
48
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Posted - 2013.04.12 14:17:00 -
[6] - Quote
CCP Rise wrote:Quote:Can you comment on Amarr slot homogenization and why you don't feel the need to break out of 4 mids 7 lows or or make a single one of the platforms have 8 lows? This is actually the thing I'm personally most unsatisfied with. Part of my goals through the rebalance was to create more slot variation overall in battleships, and one of the best previous examples of this was the 8/3/8 Geddon. We had some versions of the Apoc with 8 lows, but in the end this layout seemed to fit best with the bonuses we wanted to go with. I'm convinced that the current lineup looks the healthiest of all the options we considered, and I expect the Navy BS to fill some of the gaps that still exist.
There is an easy fix to this that many have proposed on this thread - Give the 8th low to the Abaddon.
Take 2 turrets out. Make it 6 highs (and 6 turrets) and a damage bonus equal to the %5 laser damage per level when @ Amarr BS level 5 (10% or something?). Then give it an 8th low.
This will give you the slot variation you're looking for that you're unsatisfied with AND help relieve the cap issues for the Abaddon by having it have less turrets to fire.
Why can't you do this? Please explain. It helps cap issues, makes slot variations among the Amarr BSs AND FITS as an Amarr laser/armor brick boat. Many of us are just so confused why Gallente is getting an 8th low when not a SINGLE Amarr BS does. |
Arya Greywolf
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
50
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 14:41:00 -
[7] - Quote
Dear CCP Rise
Why does the Geddon have 7 highs? Please remove 1 and give it another mid.
It has a whole host of things to put in mid slots compared to highs.
Things to put in mid: cap boosters (maybe 2 because of neuts) drone tracking link, prop mod, web, scram/point
Things to put in high slot: launchers and neuts
Thus, it should look like this:
6 highs
5 mids
7 lows
Thanks for reading. |
Arya Greywolf
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
51
|
Posted - 2013.05.08 23:05:00 -
[8] - Quote
Flyinghotpocket wrote:Arya Greywolf wrote:Dear CCP Rise
Why does the Geddon have 7 highs?
WHY DOES THE CURRENT ARMAGEDDON HAVE 8 HIGHS?  because its amarr. why does the widow have 8 mids?
You're caps doesn't make your flawed logic any better.
The old Geddon had 7 turrets and a ROF bonus and 3 mids because it was a laser tank and gank boat. That makes sense, and seemingly, what you're arguing now.
Seeing as there is tiercide and CCP Rise's massive change to the Geddon (like it or not I want to make it useful), it doesn't make sense to have so little mids and 7 highs to to point where fitting anything decent in the lows + high slots will cause absurd fitting problems with lack of powergrid (t2 heavy neuts/t2 heavy lasers + armor mods? I don't think so).
Because a capsuleer would seemingly want to use the new neut/drone bonuses (f*ck me right?) it makes a hell of a lot more sense to give it another mid.
Why?
The new Geddon is lacking PWG for sure, this is been shown in this thread already. Trying to fit heavy neuts and lasers or missiles AND a decent tank will be extremely difficult and exceedingly impossible.
What WOULD be useful would be to give it another mid slot for very important things for the Geddon's new bonuses. Namely, cap boosters and/or omnidirectional drone tracking links. To use the ship's new bonuses it will be mandatory to have a cap booster (most likely want 2 if you're serious about the neuting). Having a drone tracking link would also be smart (drone bonus waves). That leaves you with 2 or 1 mid slots left for a mandatory prop mod and the possibility of 1 e-war.
That's pretty sad - not to mention to pwg issues the boat will have with 7 highs and 7 lows.
CCP Rise, please change the slot layout to the Geddon. If you're going to go ahead with the massive change to the iconic Geddon and change it to a drone and neut boat, it NEEDS the mid slots, not the high slots.
High 6
Mid 5
Low 7
Having EVERY Amarr BS have 4 mid slots is absolutely bland, not to mention the above reasons I just presented to you. |
Arya Greywolf
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
52
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 00:52:00 -
[9] - Quote
Ashlar Vellum wrote:Arya Greywolf wrote:CCP Rise, please change the slot layout to the Geddon. If you're going to go ahead with the massive change to the iconic Geddon and change it to a drone and neut boat, it NEEDS the mid slots, not the high slots.
High 6
Mid 5
Low 7
Having EVERY Amarr BS have 4 mid slots is absolutely bland, not to mention the above reasons I just presented to you. H6 M5 L7 is a Domi slot layout.
So? Why purposely gimp the Geddon as a drone/neut ship that absolutey needs as many mids as possible over the highs (when there is no bonus to a high slot weapon) just because the Domi already has the same slot layout?
Moreover, CCP and CCP Rise are obviously willing and HAVE changed other racial slot layouts to trample over past Amarr boats (i.e. the new 8 low slot mega).
"Because another ship with 1 similar bonus out of two has the same slot layout we can't do another ship with the same slot layout" is not good reasoning.
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Arya Greywolf
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
52
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 01:10:00 -
[10] - Quote
Ashlar Vellum wrote:Arya Greywolf wrote:Ashlar Vellum wrote:Arya Greywolf wrote:CCP Rise, please change the slot layout to the Geddon. If you're going to go ahead with the massive change to the iconic Geddon and change it to a drone and neut boat, it NEEDS the mid slots, not the high slots.
High 6
Mid 5
Low 7
Having EVERY Amarr BS have 4 mid slots is absolutely bland, not to mention the above reasons I just presented to you. H6 M5 L7 is a Domi slot layout. So? Why purposely gimp the Geddon as a drone/neut ship that absolutey needs as many mids as possible over the highs (when there is no bonus to a high slot weapon) just because the Domi already has the same slot layout? Moreover, CCP and CCP Rise are obviously willing and HAVE changed other racial slot layouts to trample over past Amarr boats (i.e. the new 8 low slot mega). "Because another ship with 1 similar bonus out of two has the same slot layout we can't do another ship with the same slot layout" is not good reasoning. I see your point, but don't you think that having 2 almost identical ships is a bit excessive.
No, not if it just makes the Geddon's slot layout counter to its bonuses. They already did the same thing for BCs with the myrm and prophecy and the 2nd bonus for those ships is actually even more similar than the Geddon and Domi's second bonus. Actually, seeing the prophecy with 4 slots makes it even clearer that the Geddon needs a 5th slot as a step up to BS class.
There are many ships in EvE with similar slot layouts (or same) and similar roles. That shouldn't be the decision maker. The Geddon was changed (for better or worse) to a neut/drone boat and now it needs the extra mid slots to compensate. |
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